Bernard Kerik to Be Secretary of Homeland Security

[PhiPsiRuss]

This is breaking news, and great news. Bernie will get the job done right.

[Shortfuse]

It'll be hard for me to trust ANYBODY who use to be the chief of police for NYC as CORRUPT AS THOSE GUYS are. They make the Nazi's look like the Backstreet Boys.

[AlphaSigOU]

Originally posted by Shortfuse
It'll be hard for me to trust ANYBODY who use to be the chief of police for NYC as CORRUPT AS THOSE GUYS are. They make the Nazi's look like the Backstreet Boys.

HEY! Have SOME respect for New York's Finest! Not every New York cop is a jackbooted proto-Nazi thug, and neither are they all corrupt. Twenty-three members of NYPD perished on September 11.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/html/memorial_01.html

BTW, Bernie was the Police Commissioner ("the Commish") - the title of Chief of Department goes to the highest-ranking uniform officer in the NYPD.

[PhiPsiRuss]

Originally spewed by Shortfuse
It'll be hard for me to trust ANYBODY who use to be the chief of police for NYC as CORRUPT AS THOSE GUYS are.

Its hard to trust anyone who makes ridiculous statements like this. The NYPD is systemically corrupt? Back it up with a credible citation. Can't do it? I thought so.

Originally spewed by Shortfuse
They make the Nazi's look like the Backstreet Boys.

Not only is your post deeply ignorant, but its insulting. You've demeaned all who suffered from the Nazis with a ridiculous statement. You've also insulted the finest police force anywhere. New York now has the lowest crime rate (according to the FBI) of any large city in America. What have you done to make the lives of people better and safer? Nothing? I thought so.

[AlphaSigOU]

Originally posted by PhiPsiRuss
Its hard to trust anyone who makes ridiculous statements like this. The NYPD is systemically corrupt? Back it up with a credible citation. Can't do it? I thought so.Not only is your post deeply ignorant, but its insulting. You've demeaned all who suffered from the Nazis with a ridiculous statement. You've also insulted the finest police force anywhere. New York now has the lowest crime rate (according to the FBI) of any large city in America. What have you done to make the lives of people better and safer? Nothing? I thought so.

Fuckin' A well said, Bubba!

[KSigkid]

That is a great news - I think he's the right person for the job.

[Shortfuse]

Personal attacks for my opinion. But I'll show you how to argue the right way.

AlphaSig, I respect the men and women who gave their lives during 9/11. But the people I'm talking about are teh ones in the higher ups.

Russ, I'm not killing and robbing people so in that respect I've made people's lives safer.


Now back to my post.

Board, take it from a NEW YORKER! I've seen this force at it worse. There is good in this police force but.... there is bad, REAL BAD. The problem is the higher ups don't give a rats arse so they're going to turn the other way.

I've seen NY finest take bribes, shoot unarmed men, heck you got them sodomizing people in the bathroom of their own police departments.

Heck the Central Park 5. Five teenagers who were forced to admit to raping a women when the evidence didn't point to them and they had to spend 10 years of their lives behind bars. Thanks to the Recent DA on that one. NYPD didn't help in that matter. We're talking about the powers that be, not the beat cops. There is a difference. That is where teh corruption that I talk about.


Russ, does Louima and Diallo ring a bell to you? Trust these weren't the only two men who were mistreated by the NYPD, this police department is just as bad as the LAPD. Both are VERY CORRUPT. Take it from a NEW YORKER (Coney Island/Brooklyn) I know of what I speak.


Now notice I didn't slam anybody or disrespect anybody on this board. Now if you would like to dispute it, then have at it people.



BTW, my older cousin is a cop. I know of what I speak (if you didn't catch it the first time)

[Shortfuse]

Originally posted by PhiPsiRuss
The NYPD is systemically corrupt? Back it up with a credible citation. Can't do it? I thought so.

Once again, Louinma(sp) and Diallo. Please look up their cases and how this was handle. Remember Diallo's case (trial) was ushered out of the city under BS pretenses.

At least give me time to respond, I don't sit here all day.

[_Opi_]

Originally posted by PhiPsiRuss
Its hard to trust anyone who makes ridiculous statements like this. The NYPD is systemically corrupt? Back it up with a credible citation. .

Doesn't the NYPD have big scandals every 20 years since its inception?? --according to my Police in America Professor--who is also a lieutenant of the DPD, NYPD is notorious for corruption.

[KSig RC]

Originally posted by Shortfuse
Personal attacks for my opinion. But I'll show you how to argue the right way.

AlphaSig, I respect the men and women who gave their lives during 9/11. But the people I'm talking about are teh ones in the higher ups.

Russ, I'm not killing and robbing people so in that respect I've made people's lives safer.


Now back to my post.

Board, take it from a NEW YORKER! I've seen this force at it worse. There is good in this police force but.... there is bad, REAL BAD. The problem is the higher ups don't give a rats arse so they're going to turn the other way.

I've seen NY finest take bribes, shoot unarmed men, heck you got them sodomizing people in the bathroom of their own police departments.

Heck the Central Park 5. Five teenagers who were forced to admit to raping a women when the evidence didn't point to them and they had to spend 10 years of their lives behind bars. Thanks to the Recent DA on that one. NYPD didn't help in that matter. We're talking about the powers that be, not the beat cops. There is a difference. That is where teh corruption that I talk about.


Russ, does Louima and Diallo ring a bell to you? Trust these weren't the only two men who were mistreated by the NYPD, this police department is just as bad as the LAPD. Both are VERY CORRUPT. Take it from a NEW YORKER (Coney Island/Brooklyn) I know of what I speak.


Now notice I didn't slam anybody or disrespect anybody on this board. Now if you would like to dispute it, then have at it people.



BTW, my older cousin is a cop. I know of what I speak (if you didn't catch it the first time)

OK . . . so you have a couple concrete examples, then a sea of emotional arguments, a horrific non sequitur to begin, and non causa argumentation - not quite the lesson you'd planned, but I think there's still some good points here to be addressed by others.

However - it seems the corruption is implied to be above the beat cops, but does that mean it extends to the top? Where's the proof of that? (also, you haven't posted any real 'proof' of corruption past anecdotal evidence, but I digress)

Also - even if the NYPD is completely corrupt, how on earth does this affect his service to the dept of Homeland Security? I mean this, too - I'm not being flippant.

[PhiPsiRuss]

Originally posted by KSig RC
However - it seems the corruption is implied to be above the beat cops, but does that mean it extends to the top? Where's the proof of that? (also, you haven't posted any real 'proof' of corruption past anecdotal evidence, but I digress)

Exactly. One should keep in mind that if any group of 40,000+ people are assembled, some will be corrupt. This doesn't mean that the entire body of people is corrupt. There is some low level corruption, but that's no secret. There are corrupt people in every GLO, that doesn't make GLOs corrupt. There are some rare, but isolated cases of mid level corruption in the NYPD, but they occur at the precinct level.

There is absolutely no credible evidence, not even anecdotal, that there is top level corruption in the NYPD. If there was, it would be on the front pages of at least one of New York's five English daily newspapers. If there are any remotely credible allegations of systemic corruption under Bernie Keric's watch, we'll hear about it in the Senate in the coming weeks.

Looking past this baseless tempur tantrum, Bernie Keric will be questioned about his ability as a manager. The Department of Homeland Security is not considered to be well managed, and Bernie Keric's reputation was not made on management.

He is known as one of the finest crisis managers on the planet. He also has experience with intelligence. The NYPD did a better job of following Al Qaeda than the CIA did, considering the scope of their resouces. He also has the reputation of being an inspirational leader, something that will be very useful with the currently demoralized DHS.

Finally, Bernie Keric projects the image of someone who is in control, something that his predecessor did not. This will be helpful when communicating with the American people. As long as he remains free of BS (and he probably will,) the public face that he puts on the DHS will be his greatest strength.

[Rudey]

I don't question anyone's corruptness. Everyone loves greed. Many people are not good people. I don't think you will find a single police force that lacks corruptness and greed though. Heck I don't know many government people that do either.

Bernie has abused his powers JUST LIKE OTHERS. One example is having his officers do research for his book. Another is having Fox reporters arrested because his literary agent thought they stole something from her. He is also a man that comes not from the good life, if you will. His mother was a hooker that was murdered by her pimp I believe. Does it make any difference? I'm sure for some it does.

Everyone is dirty. You have Kofi Annan and his son bathing in the blood of Iraqi children and some might say they're great, good hearted folk.

-Rudey

[Peaches-n-Cream]

I know that his mother was murdered when he was a little boy. I have no idea about her being a hooker. He also dropped out of high school, but graduated through correspondence classes. Nothing came easy for Bernard Kerik.

Diallo and Louima were two of the saddest chapters in the history of the NYPD and New York City. Louima was the result of one, perhaps two. rogue cops behaving in the most horrendous and disgusting way possible. Regarding Diallo, I think that the NYPD has made efforts to educate their officers to prevent a repeat of that tragedy. There is no justification for either situation.

I actually thought that Raymond Kelly might be nominated for this position.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by Peaches-n-Cream
I know that his mother was murdered when he was a little boy. I have no idea about her being a hooker. He also dropped out of high school, but graduated through correspondence classes. Nothing came easy for Bernard Kerik.

Diallo and Louima were two of the saddest chapters in the history of the NYPD and New York City. Louima was the result of one, perhaps two. rogue cops behaving in the most horrendous and disgusting way possible. Regarding Diallo, I think that the NYPD has made efforts to educate their officers to prevent a repeat of that tragedy. There is no justification for either situation.

I actually thought that Raymond Kelly might be nominated for this position.

"It was not until decades later, while writing his memoirs, that he discovered his mother had been an alcoholic prostitute who had been murdered in Ohio."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4065105.stm

-Rudey

[Shortfuse]

Originally posted by KSig RC
OK . . . so you have a couple concrete examples, then a sea of emotional arguments, a horrific non sequitur to begin, and non causa argumentation - not quite the lesson you'd planned, but I think there's still some good points here to be addressed by others.

However - it seems the corruption is implied to be above the beat cops, but does that mean it extends to the top? Where's the proof of that? (also, you haven't posted any real 'proof' of corruption past anecdotal evidence, but I digress)

Also - even if the NYPD is completely corrupt, how on earth does this affect his service to the dept of Homeland Security? I mean this, too - I'm not being flippant.

But the problem lies here. Alot of that crap doesn't get reported adn who do you think sweeps this stuff under the rug. My Drill Sergant had a saying that ISH flows downhill. Meaning it all comes from the top. Somebody is held responsible, leadership has it's responsiblities. You (the head honcho) are responsible for what goes on and the punishments should be swift.

My concrete examples are more than enough. This is absolutely terrible to begin with. Now should the man in question be punished for each and every one of them no? but please respect the fact of me being a New Yorker and not being comfortable with this.